- Edited
Thanks for the head's up on that typo.
Thanks for the head's up on that typo.
BTW the osTicket Awesome releases for 1.10 and 1.10.1 are now available. Thank you for your interest.
www.osticketawesome.com
Hey 0xFF,I revisited this thread just now and thought it may be interesting to expand upon what you said regarding the staff side:>On designers side, the reason why is quite clear : it's far more of work and difficulties to provide both sidesActually, you are more correct than you may realize! It's not that creating a theme for both sides is twice as much work or even 3x as much work... osTicket's code base is very difficult to work with, and I would estimate that themeing the staff side is at least 10x as much work as the client side. I assume that is why (to my knowledge) no one has attempted it before.>I'm wondering if the staff side is really useful; it's not an answer but a reflexionIt is interesting for me to encounter this perspective. When I started using osTicket 1.7, it quickly became the center of my business. It improved my workflow in more ways than I could have predicted, but I found it painful to look at. I started tweaking the layout for my own internal use... I never had any intention of developing a commercial product. And, actually, my entire focus was the on the Staff side. I found myself having multiple editing sessions, sometimes for hours at a time. I was so invested in my own tweaks that I didn't upgrade my osTicket until 1.9, and at that point I would often spend an entire day editing to try and make everything "just right".At some point I thought to myself, "I have put hundreds of hours into this. It's too bad that no one (outside of my small business) is ever going to use it". At that moment I heard the echo of something a Unix guru / friend had said to me years earlier, "You can take an open source project and turn it into a commercial product". I think he used Apple's OS X as an example. I wasn't even aware at that point that other osTicket themes existed. But when I saw their price point and —comparatively — how little effort had gone into them, I decided to go down that path.Obviously, there is a huge difference between designing something for one's own use vs. designing the same thing for the masses. The first step was to comb through my own code and divorce myself from it. And I also decided to begin to working on responsiveness.And it was at at this juncture that I began to work on the Client side. Truthfully, I have yet to use the Client side for my own business. I have always intended to, and I still do. But clearly my relationship with osTicket evolved into much more of a distraction than I ever expected. So that's my story. Not only is osTicket Awesome the only theme (at this point) that addresses the Staff side, its initial focus was entirely on the Staff side. If the argument were made that the Client side is the public-facing part of osTicket that represents one's organization and thus the most important to improve, I could counter by saying, "Good point. But in most scenarios the Client side gets little use compared to the Staff side. Your clients log in, open or review a ticket and then they're gone. Whereas the Staff side is monitored and used all day, every day."But now you have made me curious. Perhaps I'll start a survey on www.osticketawesome.com and ask people which side is more important to them.
My "responsive theme" is a few jquery hacks for staff.. hardly seemed worth releasing because it was so simple. I assumed everyone else was doing that too.
It sounds like you're conflating the words "responsive" and "theme". In any event, good on ya. I'd love to see your what you've come up with!
Your analysis is interesting, stevland and no doubt you're a passionated person... Nevertheless, I'm always surprised to see that design (even if theming involves coding, it's not as heavy as it is in core development) is priced higher than underlying material. I'm software author since 30 years (eg. ffh-lab.com) and I have more and more the impression that we're going more and more to a world where the engine room is negiligible and the color of the paint and the size of the bumper are of prime importance!Take a look here: dedeecation.com. Dedee is the only one Win/Mac software for ebook signing on earth. It's around 60,000 lines of original C/C++ code, two years of full time dev (one man) to reach the first public 1.0 release... And it's currently $8 (has been $40). Another example: shopifight.com. Alify (name of the software) is close to the same size with less of innovation but a higher level of complexity. It's $111, while marketers around me are selling courses and trainings in the field Alify is targetting (ie. e-commerce) at prices like $1,000 to $3,000 for 10 to 30 hours of videos stored in a back office...For me, even if you put passion and effort (again, no doubt about this), your theme is too pricey (even if psychologically in accordance with this showcase world).
I certainly agree that it feels rather cheeky to enhance a free product and put a premium price tag on it. I initially had reservations about how the market would react to that. We all assign our own value to things, and each of us will look in awe at what other people are willing to pay for things.It is somewhat disheartening to read your thoughts on this as they pertain to my offering, 0xFF, but I respect and appreciate your opinion. I'm sorry to hear that you're feeling cynical about the state of the world in this regard. But you're probably right, and what's more, it's probably always been exactly as it is now.Who sold more Hound Dog 45's... Big Mama Thorton or Elvis? The correct answer is: Big Mama who?To extend this conversation a little further, I personally see value and limitations for the consumer in both open source and proprietary software business models. I also recognize, however, that for many people open source software is more than a business model: it is a value and a culture. And I do respect that.As it happened I was reading the old thread on DMT's theme yesterday before your last comment arrived. I was noticing the incredible enthusiasm that he received in this forum for his free theme. It dawned on me that I can never expect the same support here for osTicket Awesome. I can't help but speculate that, had I made osTicket Awesome free, I would have been more eagerly embraced by this community. And had I later spun-off "add-ons" or premium services (such as hosting or whatever), I further hypothesize that none of the enthusiasm would have waned.I hope you don't read this as a gripe, it is actually the inverse of a gripe. I am thinking out loud here. You are the first person to politely express your view that my theme is "too pricey". But I am willing to wager that there are far more people in this forum who agree with you than not. And thus, all things considered, I super appreciate that the status quo here has at least been so tolerant of my shamelessly self-promoting posts. :)
Don't be fooled, stevland, I don't defend open source against closed source (even if talking about scripting language and theming on it, the question is a non sense) nor free against commercial. I gave in both fields and, as you stated, both have pros and cons... No, I'm not choked that you try to sell your creation over a free open source software on its own forum (it's even courageous), I simply expressed the fact that we've been ported in an era where there's no relationship between the cost (in term of time, material, inventivity, human investment) and the final price!Last year, suddenly my main competitor changed his commercial policy, switching his software with an attractive free forever starter plan... At first sight, one could think it was counterproductive and stupid, but their intention was elsewhere : in a short time, everyone becames fan and they increased their users base to be in position for a premedited business deal: the e-commerce platform on which their software is based (just like mine, since we are talking about software communicating with e-commerce platforms) bought them for $15M. They didn't switched to free (not open-source since it's hosted only platform) because they were altruists, but because the users were a better "products" for sale (it's not cynical, it's pure observation of the facts).So, again, I really don't opposite free against commercial nor open vs. closed source, we never know the real intention in background... We just know what we (each) are ready to pay (in money, time, creativity, etc) for a specific thing depending on our personnality, background, knowledge, lifestyle, etc.It's sure you're not at the better place to succeed to sell your theme, but you're maybe at the better place to acquire a big users base...Just my two cents ;)
total crap.. comes to a place of free forum where a FOSS product obtain feedback and share for free, but with intentions to attract and sell .. the devil is more baby
mckaygerhard this thread is really old.
Please do not be a necromancer.
Killing zombie thread with headshot.